Interviewer.

How did you find out about the Putsch on 19 August?

D. Skulte.

The Putsch? I found out about the Putsch by watching television.

Interviewer.

The Dance of the Little Swans?

D. Skulte.

Yes, there was the Dance of the Little Swans, and then that announcement was read out. Of course, right away…

Interviewer.

Were you in Riga?

D. Skulte.

Yes, I was in Riga. I rushed to the Saeima – not the Saeima, the Supreme Council. There was that meeting, which was, in a way, an enlarged Presidium meeting or whatever it was called, with the Popular Front… Since I was the head of the Popular Front faction in the Supreme Council, all those issues were decided there. I was pleased that Gorbunovs’ [Chairman of the Supreme Council of the Republic of Latvia] position was concrete and firm enough. Well, and then…

Interviewer.

I think it was rather early, around 10 or 11 o’clock, when Gorbunovs issued…

D. Skulte.

Yes, that is when the meeting took place; it was at that time.

Interviewer.

Because there was no information…

D. Skulte.

And afterwards there were these meetings, and then a situation developed about which we don’t talk enough nowadays. Because we have to keep in mind that we were in a complete information lock-out. So that communication… The telephones weren’t working, this and that… So the link with the district… communication with the Cēsis branch of the Popular Front was not possible.

Interviewer.

The television building was captured in the evening; the radio building was captured in the afternoon and night…

D. Skulte.

But since there were no communications, but there were all these Supreme Council documents which had already been adopted, they were photocopied, and then we, members of the Supreme Council from the countryside, went to our districts. I had already set up a joint meeting with the entire district management and Popular Front management over there. Then I brought the documents and explained the situation. Well, I wouldn’t say people were afraid. No, of course not! But there was a certain amount of confusion – what will happen now?

Interviewer.

Well, the situation was different from that at the time of the Barricades.

D. Skulte.

Yes, of course.

Interviewer.

How would you describe it? Was it more serious or…

D. Skulte.

I would describe it as being much more serious. Now there’s another thing I remember well. I went there and we discussed everything. Then Stūrainis, the Head of the Department for the Interior of Cēsis, got up and asked, rather personally: “So what should I do now?”  Because actually all the people working with internal affairs… In principle, they were constantly in a state of divided allegiance: they had Pugo, Minister for the Interior in Moscow as their big boss – he was a member of the Politburo or whatnot – and here they had the Minister for the Interior of Latvia. They did their share of manoeuvring between the two. Of course, I have nothing negative to say; the Head of the Department for the Interior of Cēsis was loyal enough, and the main issue was public order; there were no politics… But now he had…  Well, then I answered: “You have to decide for yourself. I cannot tell you to do either this or that! You choose. No one will reproach you here.” Then he said: “Well, I am staying in this room.” And, in principle, he made it clear during that meeting that it was over; the Putsch had put an end to it for him, and he was where he had to be. Well, if just a detail like that…

Interviewer.

And then?

D. Skulte.

Then, of course, after that meeting, it was evening already, I rushed over to relatives I had in Rauna. They said that everything was all right; whatever will be, will be. And then my brother-in-law drove me to Riga at night in his VAZ because I had to get there somehow; there was no public transport, and we had a meeting planned for the next morning – 20 August. As we were driving out of Rauna, we saw a huge fire – the Rauna hospital was on fire. Of course, it had nothing to do with the Putsch; it was just a coincidence. But the whole municipality was in such…

Interviewer.

Stress.

D. Skulte.

In stress. The whole hospital was in flames, all this on top of that information… And then on the way back, coming into Riga, the highway was completely deserted.

Interviewer.

But weren’t the armoured personnel carriers there?

D. Skulte.

The armoured personnel carriers were in the Jugla area of Riga and at another intersection along the way. But they were not performing any checks or anything. The cars were just parked there so they would have a psychological effect – to dominate, to show who was in charge.

So I came back, and then the next day was very interesting because, essentially, it was clear to us that nothing would be decided here, that everything was… it took little effort to capture the radio station… anything was possible, and no one would put up armed resistance. It was clear that the whole thing would be decided in Moscow. But it was not that easy to get information. And then you [Jānis Gavars, member of the Supreme Council of the Republic of Latvia], Edvīns [Inkēns, member of the Supreme Council of the Republic of Latvia] and I… As members of the Supreme Council we had access to the Rīdzene hotel, and there was Gulbis, who was the manager of the hotel. Well, that was one of the few places that already had these satellite antennae and where a signal could be captured.

Interviewer.

There was also a government telephone which was working.

D. Skulte.

Yes, there was the government telephone, and we could watch live broadcasts from Moscow on CNN, which happens regularly now – from any hotspot, and it’s nothing new to anyone anymore. But then there was that information and, of course, everything we saw on television we tried to pass on to everyone else by phone or some other means.

And then, basically, on Tuesday night already… It was clear that… And then on Wednesday at noon already there was information that the Committee was fleeing… And then we had the historic vote because…

Interviewer.

What do you remember about it?

D. Skulte.

There was a good deal of stress, and many people were somewhere else; they weren’t there… Later on there would be disagreements about who was there to vote and who was not. But, overall, I think, the decision for us was the same as it was with the Declaration [on the Restoration of Independence of the Republic of Latvia, adopted on 4 May 1990]: we had to choose which road to take. The Estonians had already done it. It was not an issue for the Lithuanians because they were already… Then we adopted… It was short enough and… Then, basically, it was clear that in any case we were on the other side, and we could no longer politically or otherwise reckon with representatives of a completely unpredictable collapsing empire, regardless of whether they were in Latvia or somewhere else… Nor with Gorbachev and the rest… It was clear that everything had collapsed there, and we had to move forward on our own and seek allies and supporters in the West, which was rather reserved towards us. Back then, during the transition period, no one attempted to recognise us and do something, but then the recognitions started – one country, then another and another… Even Russia itself.

Interviewer.

How did you feel at the moment you were pushing the button or raising your hand? You could practically see through the windows the smoke grenades flying, the armoured personnel carriers…

D. Skulte.

A couple of members of the Supreme Council got their share of action – Jānis Kinna, I think; they had gone to take a look out of curiosity. Well, soldiers were given orders, and they didn’t care who was or was not a member of the Supreme Council. They had their last demarche there – the OMON drove through the Dome Square up to the barricades, that’s how it all was. Surreal. Well, all right! So they would come, arrest us, take us away. That is how it would be. But, in any case, fear or anything like that… There are things that have to be done because there is no other option. To surrender or flee or change our position – that…. Well… No one…

Interviewer.

Were you ready for the worst case scenario?

D. Skulte.

Subconsciously – yes, but I was not afraid; there was no calculating of where to flee, where to hide and where to get some kind of contingency bunkers – I had not even thought about that, much less prepared to…

Interviewer.

But they were even handing out weapons here. Some members of the Supreme Council who wanted to could get those little handguns or whatnot…

D. Skulte.

That’s right. All kinds of things happened. And then, I remember, that night we stayed in the Saeima building, and only a few people were left. Ziedonis Čevers [member of the Supreme Council of the Republic of Latvia] himself was guarding the barricades with a machine gun.

Interviewer.

He was lying on the ground somewhere in front…

D. Skulte.

Yes, everyone had pretty much gone off… Of the big bosses, Andrejs Krastiņš [Deputy Chairman of the Supreme Council of the Republic of Latvia] was in his office; he was in charge of everything… That was also rather ambiguous… He was saying that someone was coming – tried to start a panic… But there was a certain calm… Then 20 August – the evening and night had already been interesting; many found themselves at a cross-roads…

Interviewer.

There was talk of a kind of back-up meeting for the survivors if the Putsch had succeeded. Do you remember anything like that?

D. Skulte.

Well, in any case… Maybe it was not strictly stated, but, in any case – no. I remember that we had hid some of our activists, such as Līgotnis [member of the Supreme Council of the Republic of Latvia and the Popular Front], I think, who could be attacked first. They were advised to go to the countryside, to some hayshed or something. I remember things like that. Due to political tactics, a part of the management who had been elected and had the opportunity to go abroad, if it came to the worst… so that we would have some kind of representation…

Interviewer.

Well, so they could have that mandate…

D. Skulte.

Yes, that is that. But no one really discussed…

Interviewer.

What about your family?

D. Skulte.

Well, my family was worried. Of course, it was worried, but I took it all with good humour and optimism. Of course, the neighbours said that some dark cars had been driving by the house. Was it true? There is no way to tell. Feeling was not pleasant even if all that wasn’t true – maybe just a coincidence. But if a car with its lights off drives up to your family’s house at night… Well…